Multiple message windows

[p45cal]

With the new ability to have multiple message windows open concurrently, I find it a nuisance when closing one that it doesn't automatically set focus back to the main Pop Peeper application window. Would there be any way of doing that? Perhaps, if it's the only (or last) message window that's open that gets closed it goes back to the main Pop Peeper app. At the moment I have to click on the main taskbar icon to bring it back to the fore (I suspect this happens when I've clicked on a hyperlink in the message to view something in a browser).
Surely, a child window being closed should make the active application Pop Peeper?

[mjs]

The way PP operates now reflects how Windows works as well - that is to say, if in some manner you essentially exit a PP message window (either by simply closing a PP window or deleting an open message etc.) then PP returns to the last window you previously used in PP (i.e. either another open message or the main PP window). In the case of opening a link in the browser - after closing the browser you are returned to that former PP message that you used to click on the link to open the browser. This seems both reasonable and intuitive.

The exception to this (that is the above) is when you might have other apps open as well. In that case as a result of how Windows operates -- you will be returned to any apps window that you may have been using in the order that you last used them. This is a "normal" Windows behavior.

Are you requesting that even though you may have been using an app immediately prior to when a PP window is closed for whatever reason that instead of returning to the last app you had been using you are then redirected back to the main PP window? I would add that in general the way PP performs now is the manner in which other Email Clients generally perform in regards to the way "modeless" behavior functions. That said, I can understand your reasoning based on the assumption that if a user is returning to a PP window their intentions would be to remain within the confines of PP at that stage and would agree this may at some level arguably be intuitive as well. But at the same time you should also keep in mind however that this is not the typical way the Windows Operating System works and therefore would operate as an exception to the rule as to how Windows performs in general.

With the last point in mind, I would say if that's what you are requesting it would probably need to be an optional setting - since some users may prefer what you requesting but, on the other hand, other users may want to see (and would expect) the typical Windows behavior of returning to the last window used or last app used (if that's the case). I'm not sure how practical this approach you are requesting would be - Jeff will likely be following up with his thoughts on this. (As an afterthought, I do recall having extensive discussions with Jeff, well over 2 years ago, regarding pretty much what you are discussing now. )

[p45cal]

While this may be the normal behaviour for Windows, I tried it with Windows Explorer (file explorer) windows and it is as you say, but with multiple different Excel files being open, when I close one (just by clicking on the top right X of its window pane, without first bringing Excel to the fore) Excel becomes the active application (except in the case where all other Excel windows have been minimised).
The behaviour I'd like to see (as an option, sure) is the similar to Excel's; when multiple Pop Peeper message windows are open, and one of them is closed by it's top right X, the user having been in another app such as a browser, then the parent of that closed PP window, namely the Pop Peeper main app window, comes to the fore and becomes the active app.

[Jeff]

It's been a while since I used Excel, but it's basically a "Multiple Document Interface." The key distinction is that none of the Excel documents are separate windows, they're all just different documents inside a single window. Anyway, this is semantics and not particularly relevant

Anyway, I think that I would like to add a possible option, but the question is how it should be implemented. Should it restore PP even if it's minimized (to the tray and/or the taskbar)? If there are multiple view-message windows open, should it instead open one of those? etc.

[p45cal]

but the question is how it should be implemented. Should it restore PP even if it's minimized (to the tray and/or the taskbar)? If there are multiple view-message windows open, should it instead open one of those? etc.

My thought behind this was only to make it behave more intuitively, or 'as expected'. If a user is going through his emails he'd like to go backwards through windows pretty much as he went forwards through them. If he's deliberately minimised a message window himself, he'll be happy to restore it himself.
If he's opened a message window, then clicked on a browser link, then when he comes back to that message window (including only to close it) then he get's put back to the same position he was in when he first opened that window (usually the main PP app.). If the user has minimised the main PP app. himself, then it should stay minimised.
If the user has chosen to leave an email message window open and he's minimised the main PP app. either to the taskbar or to the tray, he's done that deliberately and it should be a deliberate act for him to restore that window. If he's opened multiple message windows, again he will have done this deliberately by moving among the panes and the main app. rather than having been presented with a new pane by double-clicking a message in the message list in the main PP app. So if something's popped-up, when he pops it closed again he's taken to where he was before it popped up/open.

This is getting to be a bit rambling, but in the case where he can see the main PP app. and any message window(s) concurrently on his screen(s), closing any message window pane will take him back (set the focus) to the window/app that popped that message window up - so every message window 'knows' where it came from!

I'm not asking for this to happen, but on an Android 'phone, it goes one step further (better?): when I open an email in an email app., later click on a browser link in that email, then navigate through several further hyperlinks in the browser app, when I repeatedly press the back button on the browser, it takes me back through the browser pages I went through, and when it lands on the page that I first got to from the email message, even if there are other web pages open in the browser (I'm sure I'm not alone in keeping multiple tabs open in my browsers), it takes me back to the email message in the email app., which I like a lot, and of course then, whether I choose to just close that email message window or delete the message, I'm taken back to the list of emails in the email app. I didn't actually notice it was doing this until I happened across another 'phone and email app which didn't behave that way - so I only noticed it by its absence. (Perhaps this is a browser thing rather than an email app thing?)

Sorry this is all quite disjointed.

[Jeff]

If you click on a link from POP Peeper, and then close that browser window (or even minimize it), you will get the behavior you're expecting. But if you alt-tab (or use the taskbar) to switch the window, then you're changing the z-order of the windows. The "Z-order" is just the order that the windows will receive focus when you change focus using alt-tab or closing windows, etc. I'd say it's very difficult to implement what you're suggesting because there are just so many factors involved, so the only true way to get the behavior you want is to change your own behavior like I mentioned above (ie. close or minimize the browser window when you're done with it).

That being said, there is a possibility to add some a simple "return to POP Peeper" algorithm, but there will certainly be some people who may not want that type of behavior because it goes against Windows standards, so it's not something that can be added haphazardly.

[mjs]

p45cal - keep in mind that PP has an option to "Close all message windows" under the "Messages" options of the main PP menu window - which makes it easy to close all open message windows with just one click.

[p45cal]

If you click on a link from POP Peeper, and then close that browser window (or even minimize it), you will get the behavior you're expecting.

Actually, this is true, but I'm not really expecting that sort of change.(In fact, I rarely minimise or close the browser completely, I only close a tab of the browser).

What I'm really looking for is that when you close a PP child window (a PP message window) it comes back to the main PP window whence the child window was opened. At the moment, when I bring a message window back to the fore, then close it, that's all that happens, it does not take me back to the main PP app, I'm left looking at whatever was behind that window (usually the browser again). I'd expect, that once you've brought ther focus back to PP, even if it is a child window, you're back in that app and closing a child window will bring you back to wherever in that PP app you clicked from to open that window. (Did it not used to behave that way - I could be imagining it, but I thought it did? I think I've got an old laptop with an old version of PP on and when I get the chance I'll try it out).
update: On the old Pop Peeper (v.4.5.2.0), only a single child window was allowed to be open at once and that window was firmly tied to the PP app, so closing the child window had to bring you back to the main PP window.

[p45cal]

p45cal - keep in mind that PP has an option to "Close all message windows" under the "Messages" options of the main PP menu window - which makes it easy to close all open message windows with just one click.

I didn't know this, thanks, however, normally, should I open 2 or more child message windows (which is rare) I'd usually still be closing them singly because for each message I'd usually be just closing, deleting, or minimising it, that is I would only very rarely be wanting to close them all at once, or process them all in the same way - I suppose I might leave a child window open just to remind me to revisit it - and even then, on revisiting it I'd expect my closing of it to bring me back to the parent app that I'm in (PP) when processing a child message window..

[Jeff]

You don't need to start the old version of PP, I can tell you that what your describing is the way that PP worked until the current version 5.0. But there are disadvantages to that method (to use technical terms, the v4 method was "modal" and v5 is "modeless"), namely that you could not open more than 1 view-message window with the modal design, and you could not interact with the main window at all. While I may not personally open multiple view-messages windows very frequently, one thing that the modeless design does allow me is to perform a search while I'm reading a message.

Most email clients (e.g. Thunderbird) do use a modeless design for the messages. Well, I guess TB may use tabs by default, but... I'm not a fan of that. Not saying that it wouldn't be added if people wanted that option (though, if I'm honest, it's not something I would consider in the near future; there are still too many other features I'd like to add first), but no one has ever specifically requested it.

[p45cal]

No, I don't want tabs, just that closing a modeless window of the app brings that app back to the fore.

[p45cal]

I'm not getting email notification even though subscribed to this thread and both the 'Someone replies to a topic to which you are subscribed ' checkboxes (Notifications and Email) are ticked, and my email address is correct so forgive the long pauses between my replies.

[spc3rd]

Hello p45cal,

I'm guessing you have already reviewed the info in the following Sticky topic:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6796

If not, you may want to do so. The Board will only notify you once of any replies to topics you are subscribed to, until you log-in to the Forums again.

I cannot think of any other reason at the moment for your not receiving notifications of replies being made to the topics you are subscribed to.

Jeff and other members of The Esumsoft Team may provide additional feedback on this issue.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

[p45cal]

I'm guessing you have already reviewed the info in the following Sticky topic:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6796

This was the problem: having started the thread I'd assumed I'd be subscribed and thought I'd confirmed it with this:

2020-11-14_131911.png (6.4 KiB) Viewed 11586 times

where I thought (wrongly) that the tick in the subscribe box meant I was subscribed!

Thank you!

[spc3rd]

You're welcome! Glad you found the problem & everything is working now.

Cheers!