Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

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Protocol
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Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

I am finding that I am constantly needing to keep resettting my OAuth accounts.
Is this normal? Why do I have to keep re-authorizing and re-entering my passwords? 🤔
(OAuthAccess empty) -- OAuth2: You may need to re-allow POP Peeper access. Edit the account and press the 'OAuth2' button to re-authorize.
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mjs
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mjs »

Are you using more than one machine to access your emails?

Are the accounts Gmail accounts (if not what type of accounts are they)?

What version of POP Peeper are you using?

What version are you using for your SSL plugin?

Is there a pattern to when this happens (i.e. after you exit POP Peeper or do a reboot)?

Is this something new (how long as this been going on)?

Have you made any settings or security changes to your computer that would coincided to when this started?

What Windows O.S. version are you using?
Good judgment comes from experience and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. - Will Rogers
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

Hi lakrsrool...

I am using POP Peeper on a desktop and laptop. I need it on both.
They are Hotmail/Outlook accounts.
I am using POP Peeper v4.5.3
I am using v1.0.2.11 SSL plugin.

I cannot find any pattern at this point in time.
It doesn't happen every time I boot my desktop or laptop.
No special security settings.
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

In my daily config, I have 7 gmail, 2 outlook, 1 yahoo (relevant because these are the 3 that support Oauth2). I'm not sure that the gmail accounts ever ask me to reauthorize them; I think the Yahoo does occasionally, but it's the outlook accounts that seem to be more regular (and it may be 1 more than the other, but I wouldn't swear to it). However, I don't think I could give a very accurate estimate as to how often any of them require re-auth. Which, to answer your original question, is most likely a security policy based on the server.

Your desktop/laptop may be independent of each other (in the sense that re-authing on one computer isn't going to affect the other), but Outlook may have a policy where you have to re-auth every 30 days which you would have to do on both computers.

I'd suggest that you record the date/time when you have to re-auth (make sure keep the 2 computers separated) and I'm guessing that there would be a pattern. This is something that I wish I would do myself, but I tend to just re-auth it without thinking about it (and, it is a little easier to do in v5 because PP provides a convenient link in the error window). You can use the "notes" in the PP account to keep track of it. I'm guessing that we'd find a pattern that it's required every X days.

Going back to my rough analysis of the 3 services, it should be noted that Outlook's implementation is easily the least refined. And, as far as I know, Outlook has never *required* the use of OAuth2, unlike gmail and yahoo; which could be because they know it still needs a little work.
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

Thanks for your detailed reply, Jeff.

I will take note of the times.
Yesterday, I had re-auth the laptop, and today I had to re-auth my desktop.

I only just noticed v5.
I might give it a try.
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

Jeff wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 8:06 pm And, as far as I know, Outlook has never *required* the use of OAuth2, unlike gmail and yahoo; which could be because they know it still needs a little work.
I think I was having problems with Webmail, so I switched my accounts over and they have been working well apart from the re-auth that has started to occur lately.
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Godiva
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Godiva »

Jeff wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 8:06 pm (make sure keep the 2 computers separated)
If they're less than 6 feet apart, do they have to wear face masks? :-#
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

The need to keep authorizing my Microsoft accounts has become a real pain.
If I switch to my laptop, I am required to re-authorize. When I re-authorize my laptop, it will require me to re-authorize my desktop, and so on.

I am just back and forwards re-authorizing. It is making me tired. 🥱😩😫
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

Microsoft does not enforce Oauth2, you can always use regular password authentication; or, even better, setup and use app-passwords.

Are you using the same ini file on your laptop and desktop (ie. on a usb stick or some other means)? An alternative might be to use 2 separate ini files -- just copies of each other -- and use one for desktop and the other for laptop. This would allow each configuration to store its own copy of the oauth data which I suspect would avoid the problem you're having.
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

Hi Jeff.

I am using separate ini files. Two separate installations. I have never heard of sharing the ini files before.

What are app-passwords?
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mjs
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mjs »

Protocol wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:37 pm .... What are app-passwords?
Specific to your question you can take a look at this topic starting HERE and continue on down the topic. This topic has links to discussions for both App-Passwords and OAuth2 for that matter.

Addendum: The post by Jeff below would be more applicable to your specific question since I now see that you are discussing Microsoft (the links I've posted are more specific to Yahoo) - sorry for any confusion. :oops:
Last edited by mjs on Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Edited to add addendum comment
Good judgment comes from experience and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. - Will Rogers
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

I thought that maybe you were using a single usb drive and using it at whichever computer you were at. Are the 2 computers on the same LAN? It's possible that MS is suspicious that 2 apps are trying to access the same account? But I have a similar setup on my LAN and I haven't seen a problem. Granted, I don't generally access on my other computer, but I did test it just the other day and I'll try again now... So, when I tried it the other day, I did have to Oauth on my laptop presumably because it had been so long since I had used it, but re-checking on the desktop didn't have a problem. Just now, I tested on my laptop - no problem; disconnected on my desktop and tried again - no problem.

App passwords are passwords that have limited access, ie. the password can access imap but not login via your webbrowser.
https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=277093
Protocol
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Protocol »

Thanks for your input, lakrsrool.

Hi Jeff. All on the same LAN.
I tried re-authorizing my Microsoft accounts again now, and this time I had to enter my backup email address for some of my accounts so I could be sent a code to enter in before I could re-authorize. I will see if that somehow fixes the situation.

In the meantime, I'll read up on app passwords.
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

That just sounds like more confirmation that Microsoft is suspicious of some activity on your accounts. Unfortunately, I don't have any insights as to why Microsoft might think that, but seemingly-innocuous things like always clearing cookies could be a trigger, or checking the accounts too often, or simultaneous email connections on the same account, etc. App-passwords might be a way to go, otherwise, you might try experimenting with things, but I wouldn't necessarily expect immediate results after you tweak something.
mdv921
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mdv921 »

The only account I'm having problems with is Gmail. Every morning when I check PP on my desktop computer Gmail has an error telling me I may need to reset the OAuth. I was doing that until I figured out that simply closing down and restarting PP took care of the problem. I was using other computers to check email with PP, but yesterday I deleted PP on the other 3 computers I use. I did check my GMail email on one laptop yesterday via the browser. Still this morning Gmail on PP on the desktop had stopped working during the night. Today I'm going to not check email on any other computer than the desktop and see if that makes a difference tomorrow morning with Gmail.
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

Have you tried to check the gmail account again maybe 1-2 minutes later after the initial fail and see if POP Peeper is able to successfully log in? Let me know if that works or not.
mdv921
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mdv921 »

I figured out that my Gmail account fails in PP every time after my computer wakes from hibernation. The computer only goes into hibernation at night, so every morning when I check PP the Gmail account has failed. No need to redo the OAuth. I just restart PP and Gmail works fine until the next night.
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mjs
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mjs »

mdv921 wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 6:00 am I figured out that my Gmail account fails in PP every time after my computer wakes from hibernation. The computer only goes into hibernation at night, so every morning when I check PP the Gmail account has failed. No need to redo the OAuth. I just restart PP and Gmail works fine until the next night.
Hi mdv921,
To understand exactly what you mean by the last sentence where you say you "... restart PP and Gmail works...."; are you saying that you "Exit" PP by either going to "File">"Exit" from the main menu or by doing a right-click on the PP tray icon and selecting "Exit" (from the context menu) and then after doing the "Exit" you restart PP?

If PP has "failed" as you have said "every morning" then PP would have an error for that failed account. Please post the "Error Overview" information into this topic for us next time when this Gmail account has "failed" before you do anything else (i.e. do this before you "restart" PP in the morning). If you are not familiar with how to do this please refer to this topic: PP error messages: How to view them & copy/paste into your post. Doing this can help us to know more about what is happening when the Gmail account fails.

Would you happen to know what period of time your "Hibernate" is set for under your "Power and Sleep" settings? (I'm curious about this setting, because depending upon what the value is; if you happen to not use your computer for a prolonged period of time other than over-night then this same thing, in regards to the error, might possibly also occur at times other than over-night).

Thanks.
Good judgment comes from experience and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. - Will Rogers
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Jeff
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by Jeff »

No need to include the error reports, I know that they won't include anything at this point.

Instead of exiting/restarting, could you simply try checking the account again after a few minutes and let me know if that works or not -- that will help me to narrow down the possibilities. Or is there already a significant enough gap between when your computer wakes and it gets the error the first time? I'm assuming that the computer waking up is PP's signal to check for email, and perhaps it's checking too soon.

Also, are you using any software that may be intercepting https communication? ie. a firewall, certain antivirus components, etc. I'm wondering if that isn't initialized yet and that's causing the problem. Interesting to note that in order for the Oauth2 to fail, POP Peeper would already have connected to the mail server, which is why I suspect it's a 3rd party interference.
mdv921
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Re: Why The Need To Keep Resetting OAuth Accounts?

Post by mdv921 »

Hi mdv921,
To understand exactly what you mean by the last sentence where you say you "... restart PP and Gmail works...."; are you saying that you "Exit" PP by either going to "File">"Exit" from the main menu or by doing a right-click on the PP tray icon and selecting "Exit" (from the context menu) and then after doing the "Exit" you restart PP?
Yes, I completely shut PP down and restart it. Once PP checks mail after the restart the error disappears with no need to redo the OAuth, and mail checking for Gmail is AOK until the computer goes into hibernation the next time, which is almost always at night as I have hibernation set to activate after 3 hours of non use. I rarely go that long not using the computer during the day.

I'll post the full error data tomorrow, but here's a screenshot of the main error page.

Image
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