View and HTML Zoom

[Dixon Butz]

Going from PP 4.1 to 4.2 makes a big change in viewing mail.
My system is
Win 8.1
Mon 1: 3840x2160
Mon 2 and 3: 1920x1080
Font Size: Custom 168%
Let me choose scaling level for all my displays: Checked.

I use PP on Mon 3 and view from 9ft away.
With 4.2 the webmail in PP got very tiny

Here is PP 4.1, HTML Zoom 100%:


Here is the same mail in PP 4.2 with 100% zoom:


If I set zoom at 200% in PP 4.2, it is still smaller than PP 4.1 and I can't read it.


Why is there a huge change in viewing mail in 4.2? Even the button images got a little smaller.
Is there anything I can do to to keep the PP 4.1 zoom levels?

[mjs]

In the meantime until Jeff can look into this further I thought I'd post my results FWIW.

What I get using PP v4.2 on 19 inch WIN7 HP laptop using a screen resolution of 1600x900 with same monitor DPI 96x96 and default zoom level:

POP Peeper v4.2 on 19 inch HP laptop

What I get using PP v4.1 on 14 inch WIN7 (older) Toshiba laptop using a screen resolution of 1093x614 with same monitor DPI 96x96 and default zoom level:

POP Peeper v4.1 on 14 inch Toshiba laptop

There does not appear to be nearly as much of a pronounced difference in my case between the two PP versions and considering I'm testing with the different screen resolutions these differences are to be expected. It seems to me this would be what to expect in my opinion since higher screen resolutions items will not only appear sharper but they will also appear smaller, so more items will fit on the screen which is reflected in the higher resolution 19 inch laptop using PP v4.2 (top image). So it appears that my comparison results are relatively negligible and to be expected factoring in the differences in screen resolution of the two computers.

For further clarification, Jeff will be checking into the forum later and will be able to provide more information at that time.

[Jeff]

Until v4.2, Windows would stretch PP's display in order to account for your DPI (168% in your case). This didn't really have any adverse effects in Win7, but in win8.1/10, it would cause everything (text and graphics) to become blurry (actually, it looks like you have win7 and there is some blurriness in your v4.1 screenshot). The amount of blurriness depended on the DPI: 125% dpi was actually worse than 150%.

In v4.2, POP Peeper now tells Windows not to stretch the display. This causes text to become crisp again, but it also makes certain elements (graphics, html) "actual size."

For your specific question about viewing messages in HTML: View a message in html and then select Options / HTML Zoom -> 400%
- does that resolve your most significant concerns about v4.2?

Why 200% html zoom appears smaller than 168%-dpi...? You'd have to ask Microsoft; the math doesn't add up for me.

I'm working on some other side-effects of the dpi change, so if you come across any other issues, let me know.

[Dixon Butz]

I don't get any blurriness. Forgot to say that was in win 8.1.
The screen caps look blurry because I have to reduce the size of the image by 50%. The screen caps are huge when using a 4K monitor.

[Jeff]

When you compare the screenshots side-by-side, you can see that the top (your v4.1 screenshot) text has a slight blurriness.

Click to enlarge; however, the irony is that when I view this image in my webbrowser, both images have blurriness (although v4.1 is still worse) because I use 125% dpi and the webbrowser tries to account for that. When I view the same image in my paint program, it looks better. And, in hindsight, the screenshots I took were also probably stretched for the same reason... but there's still a distinct difference between v4.1 and v4.2, so the point is still valid even if the screenshots aren't a direct representation of what is actuality.

[Dixon Butz]

I'll post a cap that is not resized in a little bit.

[Dixon Butz]

Here is 4.1



and this is 4.2



I guess I see a slight blurriness now.
Edit: Maybe I could see the blurriness better if had my new glasses

[Jeff]

The blurriness is a definite problem in v4.1 that had to be addressed. In your case, it's not as bad as in others (I think 125% is a fairly common dpi setting and it's also probably the worst-case scenario for blurriness). In some cases, some people may not think that the side-effects are worth it, but I am working on those issues so hopefully everybody will be happy soon.

So, that's why I need to know whether the HTML zoom level of 400% is an adequate solution for you, or if there are other issues that have also manifested in v4.2 (I do have a current list of about 5-6 items)? I should mention that I've already added to my notes to include additional zoom levels, so if 200% is too small and 400% is too big, there will be some levels in-between.

Also, for a more distinct difference of the blurriness, see this blog post (win10, 125%dpi):
http://www.esumsoft.com/blog/pop-peeper-v4-2-dpi-fixes/

[Dixon Butz]

400 is way to big. Need 250 or 300.

[Jeff]

Ok, that can be taken care of with an ini edit:
1) From the main menu, select Tools / Options;
2) Select the Storage page
3) Select & copy the value for Ini location
4) EXIT POP Peeper
5) Edit the ini file from step #3 using a text editor. You should just be able to paste the value into the Windows Run prompt and it will open in notepad by default
6) Search for HtmlZoom
7) Change its value to 300, e.g.
HtmlZoom = 300
8) Save the file
9) Restart PP and see if the zoom is good; repeat from step#4 if you need to tweak it

[Dixon Butz]

250 is good for some HTML mails. Like that eyeglass perscription email above.
But for HTML mails with just text, the text is too big. Even 200 was too big. This is 250 in 4.2


Plaint text emails like this example is a good size. From 4.2


There seems no way to have text size like that with HTML mail. Some mails would be unreadable.
It wasn't like this in 4.1. Font sizes were the same between those 2 above.

[Jeff]

There is an "HTML font size" option under the Options menu (next to html zoom) -- have you tried adjusting that?

If you get it set to the way you like, I would have some follow-up questions for you so that we can get this correct by default.

[Dixon Butz]

There is an "HTML font size" option under the Options menu (next to html zoom) -- have you tried adjusting that?

If you get it set to the way you like, I would have some follow-up questions for you so that we can get this correct by default.

Forgot about HTML font size.
Setting to smallest seems to work. Now it is just a little bigger than plain text email.

[Dixon Butz]

I think it is okay they way I have it set. 250% with smallest HTML font size.
Thought I found an issue with a HTML email with a pretty small font. But seems when viewing that mail from 6/9, when I change the HTML font size, it does not change size. Found one from Feb where the font was slightly bigger, but size did not change after selecting other sizes.
I checked those 2 mails in 4.1 and could not change size either. No biggie. Not a issue.

[Jeff]

Ok, so based on what you've reported so far, here's the relevant information:

Mon 3: 1920x1080
DPI: 168%
HTML zoom: 250%
html font size: smallest

Missing: what's your plain text font and size set to?

Out of curiosity, do you use different DPI's for each monitor? PP is only "system" aware, so it will assume the DPI that your primary monitor is set to.

As for the other messages that aren't affected by font size -- is it possible they're using images as text? I'd be kind of curious to check them out, so send me the source if you want: File / Save message as, and then email the attachment to (support at esumsoft dot com). Remind me why you're sending it in the email

[Dixon Butz]

Ok, so based on what you've reported so far, here's the relevant information:

Mon 3: 1920x1080
DPI: 168%
HTML zoom: 250%
html font size: smallest

Missing: what's your plain text font and size set to?

Out of curiosity, do you use different DPI's for each monitor? PP is only "system" aware, so it will assume the DPI that your primary monitor is set to.

As for the other messages that aren't affected by font size -- is it possible they're using images as text? I'd be kind of curious to check them out, so send me the source if you want: File / Save message as, and then email the attachment to (support at esumsoft dot com). Remind me why you're sending it in the email

Plain text font size is set at 10. Setting it to 12 seems to be the size of HTML Font Size smallest setting.
I use "Let me choose scaling level for all my displays: Checked." So all three monitors use 168%. That way when dragging windows from a 4K to a 1080 monitor, the window does not shrink and re-enlarge when dragging back. And it is readable on the 27" 1080P's. It also keeps everthing the same size. My 4K monitor is 65 inches.
I'll send one of those emails.

[Jeff]

What's the font face you're using (e.g. tahoma, ms sans serif, etc.)?


regarding the fixed-font sized message --
The problem is that the HTML explicitly states what the font/size should be:
<p style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:11px">

In the example you sent, they shouldn't have done this because a specific font-size isn't necessary. By explicitly specifying the font-size, the browser has to adhere to it. Whereas, if the font-size was specified as "1.0em" (or not specified at all), then the browser would have more flexibility to use the user's settings.

[Dixon Butz]

What's the font face you're using (e.g. tahoma, ms sans serif, etc.)?


regarding the fixed-font sized message --
The problem is that the HTML explicitly states what the font/size should be:
<p style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:11px">

In the example you sent, they shouldn't have done this because a specific font-size isn't necessary. By explicitly specifying the font-size, the browser has to adhere to it. Whereas, if the font-size was specified as "1.0em" (or not specified at all), then the browser would have more flexibility to use the user's settings.

I saw that 11px thing.
Plain text font is Tahoma size 10 which is default I guess.

[Jeff]

OK, I'll be looking into this soon.

[Jeff]

Ok, I've been dealing with other DPI related stuff, but I've finally gotten to this and here's what I've found:

All tests done in Win10 with 168% dpi

PP v4.2 100% html-zoom
-- baseline

PP v4.2 200% html-zoom
-- pretty much exactly 2x as large as the baseline, which makes sense.

PP v4.1 100% html-zoom
-- The resulting HTML display is roughly 2.75x larger than the baseline, which makes no sense. I would expect it to be 1.68x larger.

I don't think there's really much that can or should be done about this. One thing I will say, when comparing the v4.1 @ 100% zoom and v4.2 @ either 250% or 300% zoom (roughly the same resulting size for 4.1 and v4.2), the text and graphics of the HTML do look crisper in v4.2, which is what this change was all about.