Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

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treb84
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Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2019 5:59 pm

Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by treb84 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:03 pm

Hey all,

Since yesterday afternoon near all my Microsoft Live accounts on POP Peeper have not been able to connect. Strangely one or two Live accounts do connect but the rest do not. I have tried deleting the accounts and remaking them but no luck. They just do not connect at all.

This has happened at odd times before but normally right itself in an hour or two. This has gone on a bit longer.

I am wondering if anyone else is having this issue.

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:28 pm

I'm aware of the issue and I've started investigating the issue. Before I delve into that, I'm going to recommend that you switch to IMAP. Imap is the preferred protocol to use and, frankly, the only people who should be using the webmail protocol is people whose imap connection is blocked (this is rare).

To switch to IMAP:
1) Edit the account in POP Peeper
2) Change the "server type" to IMAP
3) Optionally (recommended, as it's a more secure login method): press the "Oauth2" button next to your login name and follow the procedure to grant POP Peeper permission to access your account. After you do this, you can delete your password on the 'General' page.

Note that when you change the protocol, POP Peeper will have to re-download your existing messages.


Even though I would recommend switching to IMAP in general, right now, I'm not very optimistic about the WebMail situation. Outlook has been making their web interface more complicated and -- for quite a while -- I've been considering whether it's worth the continued effort to support WebMail for Outlook. I plan on taking another look at it, as time between often proves more valuable than you'd think, but like I said, I'm not very optimistic and this update could be the one that I finally have to say that it's not worth it. To be clear: I'm only referring to WebMail support for Outlook/Hotmail. And while I may have similar sentiments about other Webmail-based protocols, each will be evaluated when necessary and I am not talking about POP Peeper in general.


Let me know if what I've said sounds reasonable, and also let me know if you are directly affected by the need for WebMail over Imap.
Last edited by Jeff on Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: edit: clarification for what I'm considering abandoning

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lakrsrool
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by lakrsrool » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:32 pm

Welcome to the forum treb84,

To better assist you please post the error overview information you are getting for the accounts that are not working properly.

You can do this by following the steps included in this sticky topic: PP error messages: How to view them & copy/paste into your post.

We also ask that new members please take a look at the following information for new users and forum members which provides additional information that may be helpful.

Other members of the Esumsoft Team may post additional feedback on the issue as well.
Good judgment comes from experience and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. - Will Rogers

treb84
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2019 5:59 pm

Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by treb84 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:41 pm

Hey Jeff,

Thanks! That looks to have fixed the issue to it's working again. I did the IMAP and OAUTH thing and it's all working now.

As for the hotmail/Live issue I can only say this. I would love to see the work continue. I bought the Pro version a while back more out of a sense of wanting to help development but I wouldn't mind doing so again.

I use POP Peeper daily/hourly for a multitude of work and home accounts. It makes things a LOT easier for me than checking tons of places. I'd hate to see this program go away (I switched from ePrompter to you MANY years ago). Might I suggest a yearly subscription model? I personally think it's appropriate here. One time payment and you get a year of upgrades, after that you need to renew at the same (or lower price). You could even add in a lifetime option for a higher price. Alternates are free with ads or something like that. This program isn't some one and done thing, it gets constant updates and that translates to billable hours.

I've been in software development and know it can be a pretty thankless job. No one wants to do subscriptions (or charge if they can avoid it) Seriously though it you are putting in 10 - 20 hours a week more or less you deserve to be paid. I don't know what your user base size is but my guess is they are like me and VERY passionate about their programs. They likely would not want to see POP Peeper be downgraded or go away.

Think about it brother! If you have any questions, you can message me here or we can talk via email.

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lakrsrool
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by lakrsrool » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:53 pm

Just got the message that Jeff posted ahead of mine. Unfortunately I did not have any of my 11 MSN accounts using Webmail so was unaware of the (-11) error problem with Webmail for MSN accounts.

treb84, you can disregard my request for the "error overview" information (which you obviously have :wink:). Sorry for any confusion (I did not see the post ahead of mine before this).

I noticed you have posted comments in reply to Jeff's post.

To clarify -- Pop Peeper is not going away... there may be some misunderstanding here. Jeff is questioning whether it's worth it to support the "Webmail" protocol is all.

And was asking to "know if you are directly affected by the need for WebMail over Imap" which does not appear to be the case as you have switched to IMAP to resolve the error situation.
Good judgment comes from experience and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. - Will Rogers

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:56 pm

Thanks for the encouraging words :) To clarify: I was only talking about WebMail for Outlook in my above post. That is, whether it's worth continuing to support that particular protocol which very few people still use and the number of people that *need* to use it is even fewer (mostly, it's long-time users such as yourself who added the accounts back when WebMail was the default [the default switched to IMAP in v4]). While I may have similar sentiment about the other WebMail-based protocols (I think Rediffmail may be the only one that doesn't support imap), they will be evaluated when they require an update. POP Peeper will continue :)

treb84
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2019 5:59 pm

Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by treb84 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:40 pm

Hey Jeff,

Thanks for the clarification.

As long as POP Peeper is humming along I am a happy camper. I don't really care about the methodology to check the mail as I only use it to 'look' at the messages and don't use it to reply or anything like that. If there protocol you recommended is the better way I have no issues switching over all my accounts (which I will do).

Thanks again.

jmpnm
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:48 am

Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by jmpnm » Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:28 am

Jeff wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:28 pm
I'm aware of the issue and I've started investigating the issue. Before I delve into that, I'm going to recommend that you switch to IMAP. Imap is the preferred protocol to use and, frankly, the only people who should be using the webmail protocol is people whose imap connection is blocked (this is rare).

To switch to IMAP:
1) Edit the account in POP Peeper
2) Change the "server type" to IMAP
3) Optionally (recommended, as it's a more secure login method): press the "Oauth2" button next to your login name and follow the procedure to grant POP Peeper permission to access your account. After you do this, you can delete your password on the 'General' page.

Note that when you change the protocol, POP Peeper will have to re-download your existing messages.


Even though I would recommend switching to IMAP in general, right now, I'm not very optimistic about the WebMail situation. Outlook has been making their web interface more complicated and -- for quite a while -- I've been considering whether it's worth the continued effort to support WebMail for Outlook. I plan on taking another look at it, as time between often proves more valuable than you'd think, but like I said, I'm not very optimistic and this update could be the one that I finally have to say that it's not worth it. To be clear: I'm only referring to WebMail support for Outlook/Hotmail. And while I may have similar sentiments about other Webmail-based protocols, each will be evaluated when necessary and I am not talking about POP Peeper in general.


Let me know if what I've said sounds reasonable, and also let me know if you are directly affected by the need for WebMail over Imap.
Hi Jeff,
I´m one of the old guys using webmail since I installed POP Peeper on my work computer.
Not working here the switch to IMAP, stay saying "Connecting..." and then "Bad connection error"
--- Version ---
OS: Windows 10 (x64)
POP Peeper: 4.5.2.0
Webmail: 4.5.11.0
SSL: 1.0.2.11
IMAP: 4.5.2.0
SendMail: 4.5.2.0

--- Error ---
jACCOUNT_1 [1000: IMAP] ['imap.outlook.com' (993) SSL: 1] [Smtp: 'smtp-mail.outlook.com' (587) SSL: 2] [consec: 1]
- Bad Connection
Last edited by spc3rd on Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Email address edited for security/privacy reasons.

dallas77us
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by dallas77us » Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:29 pm

which very few people still use and the number of people that *need* to use it is even fewer (mostly, it's long-time users...who added the accounts back when WebMail was the default [the default switched to IMAP in v4])
I wasn't aware of this. WebMail is click and go setup convenient but I can switch to IMAP at any time.
Jeff wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:28 pm
let me know if you are directly affected by the need for WebMail over Imap.
The only thing that would affect me directly after almost 12 years is if POP Peeper went away and your assurances that it won't is very, well, assuring. That said, treb84's suggestion of a yearly subscription with an initial fee and then discounted renewals is OK by me.

My need for POP Peeper is like that of treb84 (we think alike), to check all my accounts, delete the suspicious, the garbage and otherwise unimportant stuff before I open Thunderbird from a VeraCrypt container for my two COX ISP accounts using POP.

I don't use Thunderbird for any other accounts, using Firefox for everything else post POP Peeper:

As for this topic's Outlook discussion, I was a MS Certified Pro for over two decades (suffering as email admin a few times), now retired and I forget what all the MS email names were used over the years, it evolved into the current Outlook and I still get a note every now and then from some one I worked with. I'll switch over to IMAP and leave it at that.

I've been using IMAP anyway for my AOL account because that's where my Netscape email migrated to after Andreessen made billions selling it to 'em. I check it for same reason as that of Outlook.

I use WebMail for my one Yahoo and three Gmail accounts, one of them from the invite-only days courtesy of my employer at the time. Again, I can switch to IMAP at any time.

I know I'll continue using POP with COX because... your Peeper is POP. :D

Bottom line, if WebMail gets in your way of support, feature enhancement and performance tweaks, etc., dump it 100%.

Keep the POP Peeper user experience as it is. No wasted space modern/metro/millennial/material re-design. Or heaven forbid, rendering with some other engine, e.g. QtWeb.

Cheers!
"This time the Republic has gone too far." -Senator Amidala

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Wed Nov 06, 2019 7:17 pm

jmpnm wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:28 am
Not working here the switch to IMAP, stay saying "Connecting..." and then "Bad connection error"
jmpnm -- try editing the account and switching the SSL to "STARTTLS" on the bottom-right-ish. Your work is probably blocking port 993 because it's forced-encrypted (and can't scan for viruses/malware), but maybe they'll allow port 143. It's still encrypted, fyi.

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Wed Nov 06, 2019 7:32 pm

dallas77us wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:29 pm
WebMail is click and go setup convenient but I can switch to IMAP at any time.
Most email servers now configure themselves when you add a new email address, but it mostly relies on Mozilla's database. There are some questionable results that make me think it's not very well maintained anymore; ie. some major ISP's that it only sets up for POP3 instead of IMAP (I think @sbcglobal.net, specifically). It gets the job done for most cases, though; and it auto-configures a lot more servers than POP Peeper did before that was added.
dallas77us wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:29 pm
I know I'll continue using POP with COX because... your Peeper is POP.
It does kind of make me laugh that I'm always arguing for people to use IMAP over POP :) Kids today probably don't even get the reference :D Ah well, I like alliteration and Mail Peeper has other innuendos...

jmpnm
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:48 am

Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by jmpnm » Thu Nov 07, 2019 4:07 am

Jeff wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 7:17 pm
jmpnm wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:28 am
Not working here the switch to IMAP, stay saying "Connecting..." and then "Bad connection error"
jmpnm -- try editing the account and switching the SSL to "STARTTLS" on the bottom-right-ish. Your work is probably blocking port 993 because it's forced-encrypted (and can't scan for viruses/malware), but maybe they'll allow port 143. It's still encrypted, fyi.
No success Jeff, maybe IMAP protocol does not work under any common business protected network.

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Thu Nov 07, 2019 5:40 pm

Sorry jmpnm, but I still haven't had any luck finding the needle in the haystack that makes it work. I'll look at it again tomorrow with fresh eyes, but I'm running out of ideas...

jmpnm
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by jmpnm » Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:42 am

Jeff, webmail (Hotmail/Outlook) is ok today...problem solved?

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Jeff
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Jeff » Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:03 pm

Confirmed... Nothing has changed in POP Peeper, though. This may mean that there were some issues with what they changed (e.g. browser compatibility); which could mean that they'll tweak it and try again soon/later. So, either way all we can do is wait and see, and hope.

Reggorf
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by Reggorf » Tue Nov 12, 2019 6:45 am

If WebMail works by controlling an IE automation object and parsing the HTML or AJAX results, and the problem is that sites change, one solution could be to leave it to the community to maintain. Perhaps by doing site navigation and parsing through user-editable Javascript.

jmpnm
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Re: Hotmail, Live, Outlook mail not working/connecting?

Post by jmpnm » Thu Nov 14, 2019 6:42 am

Again problems today on Hotmail/Outlook Server Type :-(

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