'Waving flag' icon out of sync with alert sound

[Mack]

Forgive me -- I might be over-explaining because I don't know the correct terms. And I might have missed a thread here for the same reason.

Ever since V5, when I get a new mail notification, I hear the alert sound, but the little waving flag doesn't appear in the tray for a minute or so. Likewise, the flag will still wave for a few minutes after the mail has been retrieved. At that point the balloon tip says "No Messages". Eventually it will disappear.

It's not a huge problem, of course, but it's a curiosity and an annoyance. Could I be doing something wrong?

Windows 7 pro, Pop v 5.11, / classic icons / change icon when checking for mail.

FWIW, I can't install 5.12 because it insists I don't have admin rights (but I do).

[Jeff]

I've never heard of this particular problem before, and it shouldn't work like this.

when I get a new mail notification, I hear the alert sound, but the little waving flag doesn't appear in the tray for a minute or so.

Is the tray icon still showing the "checking for mail" animated icons?

Likewise, the flag will still wave for a few minutes after the mail has been retrieved. At that point the balloon tip says "No Messages". Eventually it will disappear.

At the point where you shouldn't have any messages and the tray icon indicates that you do, if you open PP's main interface, can you check a few things:
1) In the status bar (bottom, far-left), does it say you have any new messages?
2) If your Account List shows a column for "new" messages, does it indicate any new messages?
3) Can you see any new messages in the list?
4) What does the status bar text say (the large middle part where it may say that it's actively checking accounts or that you have X minutes until the next check)?

FWIW, I can't install 5.12 because it insists I don't have admin rights (but I do).

Is this during manual installation or auto-update? Assuming it's manual -- When you run the installer, the very first thing that it will prompt you for is to run with elevated rights (ie. when the rest of your screen goes dark and Windows prompts you something like, "this app wants to make changes to your computer" -- you have to say "yes"). If you're not getting that prompt, then try right-clicking on the installation file and select "run as administrator".

[Mack]

Is the tray icon still showing the "checking for mail" animated icons?

Yes, the little eyes pop up when I check manually (double-click) and during auto-check. If I do a manual check during the period after the alert has sounded and before the flag (eventually) appears, I see the 'checking' animation but the flag still does not appear. If I manually check after mail has been retrieved (and the hover text says "no messages") the flag continues waving.

Basically, it appears that the flag animation is delayed by about a minute from the events that should trigger its appearance and disappearance, and manual checking doesn't affect that.

At the point where you shouldn't have any messages and the tray icon indicates that you do, if you open PP's main interface, can you check a few things:
1) In the status bar (bottom, far-left), does it say you have any new messages?
2) If your Account List shows a column for "new" messages, does it indicate any new messages?
3) Can you see any new messages in the list?
4) What does the status bar text say (the large middle part where it may say that it's actively checking accounts or that you have X minutes until the next check)?

Everything appears normal. No new messages are indicated (just as the tooltip / hover text says "no messages"), but the flag is still active, on its own schedule.

I'll make certain to check again the next time I get an alert, but honestly, the only thing that's different about this version is this timing anomaly with the animation.

FWIW, I can't install 5.12 because it insists I don't have admin rights (but I do).

Is this during manual installation or auto-update? Assuming it's manual -- When you run the installer, the very first thing that it will prompt you for is to run with elevated rights (ie. when the rest of your screen goes dark and Windows prompts you something like, "this app wants to make changes to your computer" -- you have to say "yes"). If you're not getting that prompt, then try right-clicking on the installation file and select "run as administrator".

Manual update. I don't use UAC at all, so the screen never darkens. I've tried both with and without "run as admin" (and I am an administrator on this machine) and the result is the same. This happened with 5.1 too, but a new version the next day (5.11) fixed it.

Thanks for any help

[Jeff]

A few more various questions:
- What icon is being displayed instead of the new mail icon?
- How many total messages do you have in POP Peeper?
- Do you ever notice any significant lag in POP Peeper?
- Any significant cpu usage (with PP) when this behavior is occurring?
- Does this behavior occur consistently every time?

- Can you include any full-screen screenshots that show both the state that PP is in (ie. the main window) along with the taskbar icon. Since this may include some information you don't want to include with the rest of the world, let's move the conversation to email (support at esumsoft dot com).

Manual update. I don't use UAC at all, so the screen never darkens. I've tried both with and without "run as admin" (and I am an administrator on this machine) and the result is the same. This happened with 5.1 too, but a new version the next day (5.11) fixed it.

I doubt that it was the new installer, more likely something was different in your environment. To the best of my recollection, the "UAC" part of the installer hasn't changed since PP v4.0 (although I did upgrade nsis for v5). But if you've disabled UAC, there's probably something weird with that. My advice would be to use the zip installation instead of the exe; it's available on the download page.

[Mack]

I have to say, I don't use PP for anything except the tray notification. I never open its interface unless I'm modifying an email account or making some other needed change. Nothing has changed in that area for a couple of years. And It's all strictly POP3, no use of IMAP, SMTP, webmail, Gmail etc. That said, it's very handy and I've come to rely on the waving flag as a visual alert.

- What icon is being displayed instead of the new mail icon?

The open, empty mailbox. If I double-click it while in this state, I get the eyeball blink as usual.

- How many total messages do you have in POP Peeper?

Usually one or two. I don't keep mail on the server.

- Do you ever notice any significant lag in POP Peeper?
- Any significant cpu usage (with PP) when this behavior is occurring?
- Does this behavior occur consistently every time?

No, No, and Yes.

I'm not sure I can capture exactly what you want, but I'll try. Thanks again.

[Mack]

OK, I have more to report. After an auto-check that sounds the alert, the flag doesn't appear until the next auto-check, in my case two minutes. If I do a manual check during that interval by double-clicking the tray icon, it does a check (the eyeballs blink) but still the flag doesn't show up until the next auto-check.

It's impossible to exactly capture this as a screenshot, because opening the PP interface immediately cancels the waving flag alert. If I don't open PP (and I never do) then the flag will go away after I retrieve messages using TBird, but not until the next auto-check, as above. A manual check doesn't get rid of the flag, but curiously, if I do one, at that point it stops waving and becomes a static flag.

Hope this helps.

[Jeff]

It's impossible to exactly capture this as a screenshot, because opening the PP interface immediately cancels the waving flag alert.

yeah, you're right, of course...

Ok, how about a screenshot or 2 of the tray icon with the mis-matched hover/tooltip text? I just want to make sure that we're on the same page as far as me understanding what the problem is. I recommend using the Windows snipping tool (or snip & sketch, whatever they call it) to capture the tooltip text, although I've been told that Win7's version of it is not as good as Win10's so ymmv.

If I don't open PP (and I never do) then the flag will go away after I retrieve messages using TBird, but not until the next auto-check, as above.

Ok, we can agree that this is the expected behavior?

A manual check doesn't get rid of the flag, but curiously, if I do one, at that point it stops waving and becomes a static flag.

What color is the envelope in this case? A blue envelope with waving flag means new mail; a yellow envelope, non-animated flag means you have unread messages; and an empty mailbox (no envelope) with flag down means no unread messages.


I think I'll have to have you send me your settings, because you're using a lot of settings that I don't typically use and so there may be some random setting doing something unexpected (or even expected but I've forgotten about). Here's how:

1) From PP's main menu, select File / Error overview
2) Hold down CTRL and press the "Copy Log" button -- you'll get a prompt mentioning the EXTENDED status log -- make sure it mentions EXTENDED which you'll only get by holding down the ctrl button. Paste that into a text file and then send that (along with any screenshots) as an attachment to (support at esumsoft dot com). Please include a link to this forum topic, as well.

[Mack]

If I don't open PP (and I never do) then the flag will go away after I retrieve messages using TBird, but not until the next auto-check, as above.

Ok, we can agree that this is the expected behavior?

Yep, I didn't mean to make it mysterious.

What color is the envelope in this case? A blue envelope with waving flag means new mail; a yellow envelope, non-animated flag means you have unread messages; and an empty mailbox (no envelope) with flag down means no unread messages.

Blue envelope




I'll send the extended log ASAP.

[Mack]

Is the tray icon still showing the "checking for mail" animated icons?

Yes, the little eyes pop up when I check manually (double-click) and during auto-check. If I do a manual check during the period after the alert has sounded and before the flag (eventually) appears, I see the 'checking' animation but the flag still does not appear. If I manually check after mail has been retrieved (and the hover text says "no messages") the flag continues waving.

I couldn't find a way to keep the hover text while using the snip tool, so I just took a pic. This is the condition after I've retrieved messages, but before the flag goes away. Just prior to this I double-clicked the icon, saw the "checking" eyes appear, then it reverted to this.

I sent the extended log to the 'support' email address as requested.


--

[Jeff]

Thanks for the log -- I've been able to duplicate the problem now and the culprit is much more direct than expected; namely, the problem is with retrieving "number of messages." I was able to see virtually every symptom you mentioned -- delayed flag-waving and clear, manual checking not forcing it to update, and I even saw the stuck new mail flag.

I'll be looking into this but, for now, the solution is to simply retrieve header/preview/entire and it should work as expected.

[Jeff]

Ok, this should be fixed for the next version (after the current v5.1.2).

The problem was that some caching was implemented (I believe it was v5.1: "Improved efficiency when calculating message stats") and when using "retrieve number of messages", the cache wasn't being told that it was no longer valid. However, the cache is only good for 2 minutes before it allows the next check to be re-calculated, which is why you got a delayed reaction.

It's possible that using a longer polling interval -- and it may need to be an "even" polling interval because of the 2 minute cache -- could better avoid this in the current version (ie. use a 4 minute timer instead of 2 minute), but manual checks could throw the timing off or not work at all (if the cache was updated in the last 2 minutes), so using retrieve-header/preview/entire is simply the better interim solution.